- Hi, it's Sohla from the BA Test Kitchen
and we're here today to have a secret conversation
about Chris Morocco, once again we're gonna be putting
his super taster abilities to the test.
This is Leah Chase's creole gumbo.
We're challenging Chris to replicate this dish
with every ingredient in just two days.
He'll be able to taste it,
touch it, smell it, but at no point will
he be able to look at the dish.
At the end of the second day,
I'll come back, taste his final creation,
and then I will be the judge.
- Tomorrow he's gonna come.
- Oh that's the apron,
that's cool I was like what kinda [bleep] tentacle is that.
So I'm definitely getting kind of seafood kind of aroma.
Ugh, okay, so we have kinda like the whole sort of like
left wing if you will of a crab body.
Really interesting kind of spicy undertones,
so we've got shrimp,
we have like a coin of a pork sausage.
This is also kinda furthering my belief that this could be
gumbo or jumbalaya, we have a lot of flavor being
washed out of it from having been cooked in this
working titled stewy situation.
So it's stripped out a little bit of like the spice
and nuance it seems like maybe it's got a little
bit of like kinda smokiness to it.
Little hard to say, I feel like the traditional sausage in
a dish like this would be andouille sausage, whoa.
Something about the texture of this,
it's like not just standard meat,
it's like organ like sweet bread,
like no [bleep] clue what that was.
The texture was like meaty nay baconey,
kind of dried out but like really,
almost no flavor of its own.
I don't know, that freaked me out a little bit.
Slippery little suckers, huh?
[bleep] hate that taste.
Where's the trash?
Uch, tasted like a [bleep] flacid little
tough nugget of liver and I [bleep] hate that [bleep].
Shrimp, great, big [bleep] whoop.
So now I seem to have a pocket of braised meat
which I'm tentatively calling pork shoulder.
So now we have like another sausage,
oh my God you guys.
So this one actually has like quite a bit of pepperiness,
quite a bit of bite to it,
so we need like a kind of like a one inch,
very spice forward sausage, so the other one was like
a little bit milder, like a mild andouille,
like a kielbasa, something like that.
We also need like a very peppery,
kind of like cayenne-forward, smaller sausage.
Is that a [bleep] chicken neck?
Have no frame of reference for what this is.
It's so subtle and so tender though.
Sohla, you back there?
- [Molly] No she's not.
- What do you know about a pig tail?
- A lot of cartilage and fat and a lot of little bones.
- A lot of fat, right?
But it should be like chewy.
- Okay, at first I was like oh is this like a chicken neck?
But these feel like too big to be a chicken neck.
- Uh-uh. - These are like burly, right?
- I, yeah, I don't--
- Okay. - I'm stressed.
- This little number,
this see it feels like, it almost feels like.
- I'm not there anymore!
- Here we have like another boney something
with like a fatty rich something all around it.
- Oh man. - That's tough, man.
- Oh [laughs]!
Chicken wing, sorry I'm back.
So now I'm getting down to where there is lots of texture.
I don't know, that's freakin' me out.
That feels like just like some [bleep]
like a lump of like fat.
This and this. - Same thing.
- I'll give you one,
we'll do it together, how about that?
- Okay. - Sure!
One, two, three, down the hatch.
What does it taste like?
- Doesn't taste like anything.
- Does it taste briny?
Oh you [bleep] guys.
Oyster, this ones a workout.
So now I'm just taking a bite of the thing.
So the flavor is actually a little bit more
understated than maybe I was like initially led to believe.
I am getting all the flavors of the meats
kind of coming into it, I'd say there's probably like
onion and garlic, some green pepper, maybe.
It's spicy in like a creole seasoning way, you know?
There's like a little pop of like dried red chili heat,
lot of pepper, salt, could this be another roux situation?
I feel like from past experience you know,
jumbalaya or gumbo is thickened with file powder,
it's like ground sasaphras leaves
which is kind of like a thickening agent
but without being like crazy-bound.
And the rice is obviously kind of hydrating as this cooks
so I'm gonna lean on like no roux
but like maybe a thickening agent of some kind.
I would call this jumbalaya and say maybe Emeril.
All right, I think I'm done here.
I'm ready to take the blind fold off,
ready to live my life.
In terms of our shopping list.
Proteins, we got crab, something medium-sized,
shrimp, two pork sausages, pretty sure that was liver
'cause I had such a violent reaction to it.
Sweet bread or kidney, I don't know,
maybe we'll pick up both, [bleep] it!
Lookin' at a pig tail, wing, flats.
And then oyster.
- You're freakin' stealin' it.
- What happened?
- No, I got locked out of my house.
- Yesterday he got locked out.
- What? - Yeah, he almost had
to climb through the window.
- I have an emersion--
- Don't say it, cut this part.
- I just ate so much [bleep] organ meat,
and like slippery - Organ meat?
- Seafood bits and like
- What are you doin' bud? - Different meats.
- What is this [bleep]?
- It's like [bleep] barnyard
and like a tide pool in one dish.
- Pig tails?
- I've never had a pig tail.
- Is it cartilagey things? - Or maybe have I?
It was some part of a [bleep] animal,
it was like tender, rowdy, rich.
- Crunch? - Well I didn't like
bite the bone. - Was it rice?
- [Chris] There was rice in there.
- Was it real loose?
- It was like thick, it was tight.
- It was tight, was there chicken in it too?
- [Chris] Yeah, there's wings.
- Shrimp, wings, this aint jumbalaya.
- [Chris] This is somebody's jumbalaya.
- This is some goulash [bleep].
- This is [bleep] like. - [bleep] [bleep] kidneys
and [bleep]. - This is like rodeo
in your bowl. - This is wild,
I think it's something someone just rift on all of this
and made a Cajun goulash. - A thing.
- [laughs] This is fun!
All right I'll mosey on. - [bleep] All right,
I gotta, okay. - Yeah, back to work.
- All right. - This is exciting!
- All right, real quick 'cause I have to go.
Onion, garlic, maybe like a dried chili,
paprika kind of situation, file with the accent, rice.
Cool, so I'm gonna grab my list, head to the supermarket
and see what I can find there.
I'm just getting at least one green pepper option.
Gonna get a coupe safety chilies.
So we're gonna get some garlic and onion, spices.
Got hot paprika and sweet paprika.
I feel like file powder would definitely be in the spice
section but I could be wrong.
If only it were that easy.
We gotta get this.
Let's check out sausages.
All right so I'm getting andouille here,
wings, chicken liver, by far my least favorite thing
about the dish, so we're gonna need some seafood.
Hi, how you doin'.
Could I have a half pound of the wild shrimp please?
And could I also have four oysters?
That actually takes care of most of our proteins,
aside from a pig tail and possibly sweet breads
or other weirdly textured organ meat.
I'm also gonna get some whole peeled,
just a couple small cans of whole peeled tomatoes
that I'll puree myself, also while we're over
here let's check out rice.
I think, honestly, what we want is just basic AF long grain,
white rice, that's it, I think that's it.
All right, we just got back from the supermarket.
I've been trying to organize my thoughts as to
what sequence all of these ingredients
need to be put into a pot.
I'm under a lot of time pressure here,
I iced myself down a fun beverage.
So I'm just gonna make this sofrito.
Sofrito is just like your aromatic base of vegetables.
Usually some combination of onion, garlic, pepper,
could be celery, carrot, depending on what you're making.
I'm gonna go for combination of green bell pepper
and then jalapeno that I'm gonna seed.
I'm just gonna pulse up the base for my sofrito.
Just want it to be super fine and I wanna cook it out
till it's like kinda pasty.
I want this sofrito to end up as closer to a paste.
This is gonna take a little while to cook out so I just
wanna have it going on the side.
In a separate pot over here,
I'm gonna start browning off some of that meat,
develop a little bit of a fond,
that we can then de glaze, it's gonna be great, don't worry.
So I've got pig tail, chicken neck and sweet breads,
from veal, so the supermarket didn't have these ingredients.
I asked for them, and our intrepid culinary team
went out and sourced them on very short notice.
Or they just had them in the back and they're totally
[bleep] with me, I'll never know.
This is like nice, smokey, hopefully fairly peppery
andouilla sausage and then this is a kielbasa.
Also, a smoked sausage, this is a combination of
beef and pork, I just want the flat of the wing.
Chicken neck, throw a couple of these in.
So it turns out that pig tails are a little bit bigger
than I was expecting, what I had in the original dish
was not pig tail, this looks like mini ox tails,
much more likely looking now,
what I tasted and felt was chicken neck,
and it does look like a richer, darker meat,
you know and maybe it does get that rich kind of more
shreddy texture that I was experiencing.
I don't know, I mean it's a real kind of mind [bleep] now.
So sausage I just kind of gave a little bit of color to,
and then I'll keep browning this stuff right here.
Just puttin' a little each of these paprikas in.
So like this is the moment where if I wanted to use flour
and create like you know, some kind of roux,
would you have a roux and then have file powder?
I mean it's not like file powder is something
I can [bleep] taste.
I'm gonna try not doing the flour today, how bout that?
So that was just a little half can of tomato.
Now I wanna cook this out.
We're gonna see how this one does today
in terms of any changes tomorrow.
I'm gonna start to bring this up with some water.
Gonna de glaze like those brown bits on the bottom
of the pot and get this cooking.
So you can see, even just the color of the water
as we de glaze these you know bits, the waters pulling
some of the color off of our browned meat.
All that is good stuff.
And then what I might do right now, put in half.
So that kinda gives us something like that.
Oh, hello buddy.
So I've got shrimp, I will be dropping the shrimp
right into the stew, I'm shucking an oyster,
although I'm not doing a very good job of it.
There we go, just wanna keep it intact
and in its own liquor, I assume this is a blue crab,
they're gonna go in our liquid, we're gonna cook 'em off.
And Hunzis gonna tell me how long.
- Eight to 10 minutes. - Okay.
- We'll go eight to 10 minutes.
- [Chris] So this is our kielbasa,
our mixture of beef and pork.
- What do you know about jumbalaya?
- From New Orleans?
- It appears that I'm not the right person
to be consulting here. - That's all right,
that's all right, it was a good gut check, thanks man.
Let's pull these out, let's see where we're at.
Crabs are out, rice gotta go in if we're gonna get it
even somewhat cooked on time.
I'm not putting a lot of rice in.
So this is chicken liver.
I don't have like some big beef with like chicken liver
mousse or whatever but just liver hangin' out
like a [bleep] fart in a car, I don't need that [bleep].
Shrimp just went in, just wanna poach them off here.
Livers just goin' in, I'm so short on time
it's like not even funny.
All right, we're gonna let this go for like a few minutes.
All right, cool!
Oysters comin' in, just gonna kind of dot
them around in there.
All right so this is my first version of the dish.
Not bad for first crack.
There's a lot of flavor going on in here,
I think I have most of the elements,
I am questioning whether there can be an herb,
you know there's always the possibility of another
spice or something, wondering about the placement of the
rice whether that feels right, I don't hate this actually.
But maybe I'll have a better sense
when I taste the dish again tomorrow morning.
Ingredients, I'll give myself an 82.
Taste, look, I will give myself a solid 85 there,
maybe even an 86.
- [Man] Technique?
- Oh, this is where I'll put myself at 70.
I feel like these things could be added in any
kinda order, you could have two pots coming together
into one pot, everything could be dumped in a pot
and brought up together like dak-bokkeum-tang style.
Who the [bleep] knows.
Appearance, I'll give myself a 78.
I mean, there's crab sticking out of bowl
and there's a whole bunch of [bleep] in it,
I didn't like put up a burger here, you know?
I'm just like waiting for that stupid actually score
to just pop up there.
All right, so that puts me at a 79% or a C plus average.
This is my first pass, but I've got one more chance
to taste the dish tomorrow before
I have to make a final version for Sohla
and I'm a little bit freaked out about it.
Okay, let's get into it.
All right, so we've got our crab here.
I wanna just see if I can determine if there might be
something on the surface.
All right, so I've got an herb here
and I'm gonna call that for parsley.
Here's like my nug, this is like the nug of doom.
That now just tastes like a slightly dry piece of chicken
thigh I guess it's probably not sweet bread.
It just doesn't really have like any flavor whatsoever.
But if I had to say, you know maybe I'll do some like
boneless, skinless chicken thigh, roll with that.
So we have our very smokey, spicy andouille.
We had our mild sausage earlier.
Got shrimp, uch, got our chicken neck.
So it seems like you guys gave me some drummettes today.
Like this actually has flavor,
this tastes like a lump of, a hunk of pork shoulder.
Wow, that wing is just like falling apart,
just feel like it's gotta have been cooked in there
for a while, I think there is a reasonable question to ask
in terms of like, was this wing possibly just dropped into
the stew and not browned off ahead of time?
Same thing with the pork shoulder, I don't know.
In terms of how I imagine this dish would be constructed,
it still makes sense to me to brown off the meat
that kind of wants to be browned off.
One thing that tells me that the sausage certainly
spent a decent amount of time in the liquid is see how
the skin on the sausage is kind of like cupped like that?
It's only gonna do that when it's been sliced
and then added to the liquid.
That kind of tightens that casing up and makes the sides
kind of bulge out like that,
giving you that little dip in there.
The texture of the rice in here, is perfect.
I think now that this rice has been cooked on the side.
Not really anywhere that different from where
I was yesterday in terms of flavors,
I'm wondering if there's just some other herb
I can be putting kind of in with my sort of chili.
There's something about the interaction with that kind of
broth I was thinking dried oregano.
- You okay, man?
- I think I'm good.
All right, let's maybe make our aromatic base here.
Let's get the meat sweating.
So I've got boneless pork shoulder,
this was not used yesterday but only
because I forgot to use it yesterday.
I've decided to go ahead and sear off the meat.
The chicken wings I feel like we can kinda
go either way on, some of the seafood obviously,
it makes sense to drop it in at the very end.
Ah, so I just pulled it without thinking about it too hard,
'cause I do have a certain amount of affection for this pot,
but it's a disk bottom pot so you have multiple layers
of metal only in the center of the bottom.
So you get these like stupid
hot spots all around the edge.
Just don't get very even cooking,
not [bleep] into it.
Before I build up too much bond in the pot
that's really upsetting me,
I just wanted to transfer, change course,
you know when you feel something is goin' wrong,
you gotta do somethin' about it right away.
So we're not going crazy,
trying to get masses of color on this meat.
Just like sweat out some of that fat,
develop a little more fond.
So I've got my milk kielbasa and then I've got
my smokey peppery andouille sausage.
I don't know why I'm having such a hard time
with those like meaty little nugs.
I don't know if I'm just making it way more complicated
than it needs to be, so I've got my aromatic base.
Just gonna pulse it up.
So, we got our aromatic base in the pot,
it's picking up all that fond,
I don't wanna rush this, I wanna cook off the water
and then I wanna just give like a light brown
and super concentration to this.
Correct me if I'm wrong but the holy trinity refers to
onion, garlic and then pepper, green pepper specifically.
- [Brad] I thought it was onion, celery, pepper.
- Onion, celery, pepper, what's that?
- [Molly] I Googled it yesterday.
- Oh you did? - Right!
- Oh it's celery? - Celery.
- Well shit. - Yeah bro.
- [Chris] Do I need to put some celery in here?
- All right, give me a celery stalk.
- Peppas. - Quick quick quick quick,
I gotta get it in there!
I don't often put celery in my aromatic bases
but it's usually just because I like can't be bothered
to like have it around at home.
All right, celery is now in.
So I've got some hot paprika.
Sweet paprika, good bit of black pepper, oregano.
Now that's giving me like zesty.
This is a tomato puree, just going in,
we're gonna cook it out again, real hard.
See how concentrated that tomato is?
It's almost turned into you know, kinda paste.
That's good, that tomato is cooked out,
we're not gonna have any more of that kinda tinny,
canned tomato flavor, cooking out tomato is something
that I firmly, firmly, firmly believe in.
I think at this point we can also add
these kinda long cooking meats.
I put one chicken thigh in there,
and I'm gonna see how it behaves.
We're gonna let the situation come up to a simmer,
turn the heat down, simmer it gently,
probably check it in like an hour.
All right so I'm gonna slice some sausage and get it in
along with our crabs, I wanna go ahead and steam off
our little friends there.
Today, the rice is being cooked separately.
All right, I want a little more heat here, great.
So we are peeling the shrimp, liver, crab.
Maybe just a pinch of salt
and then liver and shrimp can go in
and then I think we're like, basically there.
All right, so straight up,
we have to break with our normal format for the show
which is that normally on the second day,
I cook the dish twice.
But because this dish takes a little while to cook,
I'm just doing one version of the dish today
that I have to serve to Sohla.
So unfortunately out of time but those are the breaks
and I think it's gonna be all right.
Rice on the bottom, these are oysters
that we had shucked this morning.
There you have it.
Emeril Lagasse's Insanity Gumbo.
How you like them apples?
For ingredients, I would give myself an 83.
Taste, I'm gonna go with 86.
Technique, oh let's call this 84.
So that averages me out at 85.
I don't think I'm gonna get an 85 from Sohla.
She doesn't even give herself 85s.
I'm so curious to find out who
the developer of this dish was,
what it's called, and how it's actually made,
and what the ingredients are.
- Here we are.
- How do you feel?
- Okay, let me get into it.
So it's just like, it's so hard!
- All right, ready?
- Yeah. - So, Chris.
- I want to present you with
Creole Gumbo by Leah Chase from the Dooky Chase Restaurant.
- [Chris] Agh!
- [Sohla] I mean they look really close!
Look at that!
- Is that ham?
- That's what the cube was.
- Ugh! - That's the cube.
How did cube lead you to chicken thigh?
- It didn't really. - Yeah?
- [Chris] I put like half of a chicken thigh
and then saw how it behaved and I don't even wanna
acknowledge the fact that it's even in there.
I thought it was sweet bread.
- You thought the cube was sweet bread?
- Yeah, it had kind of like an organ-y.
- Oh, yeah yeah. - Know what I mean?
- Can I eat a cube? - Together?
- That does not taste like ham.
- It does not taste like ham.
She just said it does not taste like ham.
- [Sohla] But like crab, crab.
You got sausage.
Leah Chase is the Creole queen, and this is a recipe
from the Dooky Chase restaurant.
- So it is gumbo.
- It is gumbo!
I'm so glad you came back from the jumbalaya journey.
So we are gonna try the original.
- And then, the Chris version.
It's quite a light gumbo, for sure.
- No roux? - No there is a roux.
- [bleep] off.
- There's roux in here!
- Is there file powder?
- There's file powder.
- [Chris] This does not have the consistency
of something with roux in it at all.
- Yeah, I feel like it was just there
for flavor, for depth.
- [Chris] I'm gonna make you a perfect bite of this.
- [Sohla] Okay, ready.
- I'm just gonna make you a taste of the broth.
- Yeah! - I mean,
you're gonna get everything you need from that, right?
You don't need to like sit there
and eat the proteins, do you?
No. - No!
No. - It's fine, you're fine.
- No. - This has a lot of body.
And I was concerned about that.
It felt like there was a little too much body
from you know, my aromatic base.
- Mhm, is there tomato in there?
- Oh yeah, I put tomato in there.
- Yeah, that's probably where that body, like puree?
- Like a small amount of puree, just like cooked out hard.
- Ingredient-wise, it looks like you did pretty good.
What sausages, what proteins,
what little animal tid bits did you choose?
- Pork shoulder. - Pork shoulder, okay.
I think that was the hardest ingredient
which was actually veal.
- Veal? - Veal, who uses veal?
I haven't seen veal in years, I was blown away by it.
- Oh my God, and then I had an andouille sausage.
- Nailed it.
- I had a kielbasa or like a mild you know kind of
blended sausage. - The judges will allow it.
- Then I had chicken neck.
- I had chicken wings.
- Crushing it.
- I had crab. - You got the crabs,
they gave you the crabs. - Whatever!
Well they didn't sell them in the supermarket.
Everyone calm down.
Shrimp. - Shrimp.
- Liver. - It was gizzards.
That was so close though, so close.
Did you brown off the liver too
and put that in? - No, I did not.
- That you just put in.
- [Chris] That I just slipped in.
- Okay, can you tell me about your procedure.
- [Chris] I browned off my pork shoulder, wings,
chicken neck, built some fond, and then I had an aromatic
base on top of that, paprika, black pepper, oregano,
I didn't end up using dried thyme.
- Oh so close with that thyme, so close!
- Was there thyme in there?
- It was thyme.
- [Chris] And then a little bit of tomato puree on top
of that and then I used water just 'cause water.
- Your order of operations were not correct.
Nothings browned, yeah. - Okay.
- All the browned flavor comes from--
- The roux. - The medium browned roux.
Yeah, yeah. - Interesting, okay.
- The way that this Creole Gumbo is made.
So you start by putting the crab, sausage, veal, gizzard,
all in a pot with no oil
and then meanwhile in another skillet,
you'll make your roux.
There's no aromatic base.
Once you get your roux nice and dark,
the onion goes in there.
- Okay. - Sweat down,
then that onion, roux situation gets poured on top
of your steamed crab and sausage deal.
You slowly add water, stirring the whole time
so the roux dissolves. - Builds up, uh-huh.
- [Sohla] And then you throw in all of your proteins.
- Wow. - Everything just goes
in there and then the oysters go in for the last bit,
just to like warm through.
- Okay, and is there paprika in there?
- Hot paprika. - Okay, all right,
I got that. - There's hot paprika
in here so you got that.
I mean, I would've never done it this way.
- Never! - Never, it would've never
occurred to me to make it this way.
So, it's time for the scores.
- Your favorite part. - Yeah.
- Even though I feel like the veal for pork
like whatever, that's like, that was an impossible one.
We'll let that slide.
The weird cubes, those cubes don't taste like anything.
- Thank you. - Who cares.
- I appreciate that. - Who cares what those
turned out to be. - I appreciate that.
- [Sohla] But then maybe like the bigger errors was
the addition of stuff.
- [Chris] Sure.
- So, how do you feel about a solid low B?
- Yeah! - Like an 82% [laughs].
- Great, all right.
- Yeah, feels good? - Yeah, sure.
- I know, it took me a long time to have you like that.
- No, it's okay.
- Taste is great.
I mean. - If you closed your eyes
and took, I mean tomato, not withstanding.
Take a flavor, a little tastey taste of that.
- [laughs] Taste is great.
Technique, technique this is where it
all comes crashing down. - Oh God, it's okay.
- I mean. - I can take it.
- 65%, the technique was way, way off.
- [Chris] Yeah yeah yeah.
- Appearance, besides the tomato
and like there's more body here,
they pretty much look the same.
How do you feel about an 87%?
- Yep, that's fine. - A high B.
So that tabulates to 82%.
- Oh my God, okay. - That's a B.
- That's like way more respectable
- That's a solid B. - Than I would have thought.
- Right? - This one was really tricky
and it was tricky, you know they're all tricky but like
this was like so unexpected.
Thanks, hey thank you, seriously.
Appreciate it. - Thank you, seriously.
- All right. - Every day.
- All right.
This, no real closing thoughts,
this was a tough one,
I definitely learned something here.
Doing the dish the way I did it,
there definitely would not have been time
to do it all over again but now I know.
What's frustrating to me is that I keep coming
very close with a lot of things,
but there's just always something whether it's
an ingredient or a technique that is not immediately
and readily apparent and ends up biting me in the ass.
And I don't wanna get bit in the ass anymore.
I feel like we are so far from being
done with types of dishes that would be appropriate for this
I feel like there are so many different cuisines
you know we haven't even touched
and just looking forward to the next challenge.
- [Brad] What's you got there, a female?
Flip her over.
No, that's a male.
- We are in unchartered territory here.
- I'll show you how.
Flip it over again.
See, this one kind of looks like a [bleep].
[Chris laughing] And that is a [bleep], that's the male.
That's it bud, little fun fact!
- [Chris] Crab [bleep]!
- Yeah, just so you know!